[ocaml-infra] Moving to lists.ocaml.org

Sun Feb 10 18:50:27 GMT 2013

I second the idea of considering registering ocaml.org with Google Apps. No
amount of work we'll ever do will compete with the features they already
have. I'm not concerned about lock-in since Google is not going anywhere
anytime soon, and if it ever does there will be a million people figuring
out how to export your data.

On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 1:41 PM, Sylvain Le Gall
<sylvain+ocaml at le-gall.net>wrote:

> 2013/2/10 Anil Madhavapeddy <anil at recoil.org>:
> > Out of curiosity, why not do the opposite as I suggested?
> >
> > I notice that all the proponents of staying on Google Groups use GMail,
> > and all the opponents don't.  It seems reasonable to be subscribed to
> > Google Groups via the mirroring scheme that Google provides.
> >
> > The search is quite straightforward.  Use Google!  "site:lists.ocaml.org
> > opass" reveals the recent password-handling discussion, for example.
>  This
> > seems like a problem we need to solve on all the lists, not just Core, so
> > I don't see why some should on Google Groups, and others on
> > lists.ocaml.org.
> >
> > If people are desperate for this functionality, I could always register
> > lists.ocaml.org as a Google Apps service and host our lists via that.
> > However, I view Groups as something of a second-class service at Google,
> > and don't really trust it in the long term.  Consider the Data Liberation
> > Front group at Google conspicuously skipping this service from their
> > "export your data" campaign.
>
> I think that registering ocaml.org or lists.ocaml.org as a Google
> Apps, can be a very effective way to build a pretty well managed
> architecture for websites, ML et al. Spend time on building server to
> test OCaml software, not managing spam and emails (I already did it
> for quite some time and I think it is not a very efficient way to
> spend my time).
>
> To be honest I don't see the point of merging the mailing list of
> Core, if the source code don't move as well to the very same server. I
> don't see why the argument that applies to ML would not apply to
> Source Code... If it is not broken, don't fix it.
>
> Concerning, the "long term" of Google Groups if anything should change
> you'll get a 6 months notice and will have plenty of time to move data
> to a new servers.
>
> >
> > -anil
> >
> > On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 11:49:04AM -0500, Ashish Agarwal wrote:
> >> Personally, I prefer google groups over mailman too. The main reason
> being
> >> there is no easy way to search over mailman archives, which is a basic
> need.
> >>
> >> If having our own archives is the only issue, maybe just subscribe
> >> core at lists.ocaml.org to the current google group and disable direct
> posting
> >> to it. Thus, core at lists.ocaml.org remains behind the scenes but we
> have all
> >> messages on servers under our control.
> >>
> >> On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 5:47 AM, Anil Madhavapeddy <anil at recoil.org>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> > We can set up a mirror to the lists.ocaml.org mailing list as
> described
> >> > here;
> >> > https://support.google.com/groups/answer/46387?hl=en
> >> >
> >> > There are some unfortunate downsides to Google groups, but mainly
> down to
> >> > losing control of our archives (there's no facility to export them
> easily
> >> > to an mbox, for instance -- reconstructing it meant that the current
> >> > archives had to be scraped).
> >> >
> >> > Core's an important part of the future of OCaml, and we'd like to
> ensure
> >> > that we have a good central repository of the components that will
> make up
> >> > the OCaml Platform.  Part of that is moving things to
> lists.ocaml.org.
> >> >  Spam is a concern, but we'll cross that hurdle when it becomes an
> actual
> >> > issue.
> >> >
> >> > -anil
> >> >
> >> > On 10 Feb 2013, at 10:42, Sylvain Le Gall <sylvain at le-gall.net>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > Hi,
> >> > >
> >> > > I am not sure about the real advantage of moving the list. The
> current
> >> > > one doesn't have obvious problem and using mailman for
> >> > > lists.ocamlcore.org doesn't demonstrate me that mailman was better.
> >> > >
> >> > > Yaron, are you aware that using mailmam is probably more work day to
> >> > > day (not counting the amount of time you'll spend to do the
> migration
> >> > > itself). E.g, AFAIK spam filtering works pretty well on google
> groups,
> >> > > whereas it is almost absent in mailman... List archive is better
> >> > > presented on google group...
> >> > >
> >> > > I'll vote to stay on Googl Group, if my vote count.
> >> > >
> >> > > Regards
> >> > > Sylvain
> >> > >
> >> > > 2013/2/10 Sam <sdefabbiakane at gmail.com>:
> >> > >> Does this mean not using google groups anymore? If so, I'm rather
> sad
> >> > about
> >> > >> this. Having a decent web UI (which google groups does) lowers the
> >> > barrier
> >> > >> to participation by a lot. (And I, at least, much prefer it to
> getting
> >> > all
> >> > >> of the messages in my inbox.)
> >> > >>
> >> > >> On Saturday, February 9, 2013 12:29:01 PM UTC+8, Yaron Minsky
> wrote:
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> Small correction: the new address would be co... at lists.ocaml.org
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> y
> >> > >>>
> >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 11:27 PM, Yaron Minsky <
> ymi... at janestreet.com>
> >> > >>> wrote:
> >> > >>>> Now that ocaml.org has an operational listserv, I'd like to
> migrate
> >> > >>>> this group over to a mailing list on that site, namely,
> >> > >>>> co... at ocaml.org.  My current plan is to migrate the list over
> in a
> >> > >>>> week.  Does anyone object to simply auto-subscribing people who
> are
> >> > >>>> subscribed to this mailing list to the new list at ocaml.org?
> >> > >>>>
> >> > >>>> y
> >> > >>
> >> > >> --
> >> > >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> >> > Groups
> >> > >> "ocaml-core" group.
> >> > >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send
> >> > an
> >> > >> email to ocaml-core+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> >> > >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >> > >>
> >> > >>
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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> >> > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send
> >> > an email to ocaml-core+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> >> > > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >> > >
> >> > >
> >> >
> >> > --
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> Groups
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> >> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
> send an
> >> > email to ocaml-core+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> >> > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >> --
> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "ocaml-core" group.
> >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to ocaml-core+unsubscribe at googlegroups.com.
> >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
> >>
> >>
> >
> > --
> > Anil Madhavapeddy                                 http://anil.recoil.org
> > _______________________________________________
> > Infrastructure mailing list
> > Infrastructure at lists.ocaml.org
> > http://lists.ocaml.org/listinfo/infrastructure
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